New C Rotor with free flooting C

[labitrail]

Hi Bob,
I have made two pictures of the floating C positioned in the middle of the half pipe diameter and in a 1:2 position showing the maximum rotation diameter and the 45 degree position shrinking to ether side. Is this the way you tested the rotors? And how much way (or angle in degrees) did you allow the half pipes to turn to the left and right? We should properly put the results of the different tests in an excel sheet to compare them and to find out which variant is worth to have a closer look at.
As I already posted in another thread I like evolutionary development. Test a bundle of variants, throw away the inefficient ones and keep the good ones for further optimization.
cu Bodo

http://abonis.eu/fileadmin/template/image/energy/C_floating_radius.jpg
http://abonis.eu/fileadmin/template/image/energy/C_floating_excetric_01.jpg

[BobMann]

I was trying to build it close to the size that you are using over there.
I was trying to keep the build cost down for my complete unit using my Mann Smart Drive.
I did install on my tree top wind mill mount I did have some wind when I was doing it and it did start to turn.
I am at a 30 inch circle for now and runing 3 blades I will let it run a few days hope we have wind to.

I will build some 7 inch C tube to bolt right on and redo the same test next week and post numbers.

See my Mann Smart Drive is a stock F&P 60 stator using my custom drum and hub with Neomagnets I can make 1000 Watts at 600 RPM
into the grid and any wing or Hydro can bolt right on to it.
But has 15 onces of brake free cogging this can be adjusted very easly but will give up some power.

I will look closely at dropping the cogging down to 6 onces and set the power output to 500 Watts at 400 RPM and add bigger C like 6 inch to just 3 blade or 5 blades with the 4 inch C.
Here is the PMA I build and sell.

Mann Smart Drive

this.JPG (132.5 KiB) 9280-mal betrachtet

Bob Mann

[Bernd]

I was trying to build it close to the size that you are using over there.

Yes thats right, but later we found out that the pretendings we used in our calculators put out
a bit to small dimensions. We found out that around 30% bigger blades will do a better job.
So today i would like to use 30% bigger blades. Then the dimensions will get close to the Lenz Blades.

You reduce the cogging by giving one alternator drum a bit offset to the other one ?

Grüsse

Bernd

[BobMann]

I will jump up on the C to 6 or 7 inch C
my Mann Smart Drive uses a slant Neomagnet setup to hlep lower the cogging but the fasted and best way on
my build to adjust it is by air gap.
Below are few post on my airgap to power and slant

Hello I have run a few test on the Mann Smart Drive with changing the angle of the magnets and air gap back to back.

I had build one of my PMA with the magnets with out any slant. I use slanting to free up cogging. and I left the stator stock Star wiring.

With .020 th air gap run in to the Ginlong grid tie volts is DC with the load of the grid tie. The Ginlong can be adjusted for volts=watts I did adjust a bit to find a sweet spot but you could spent all day trying to get it right.

This is were Steve is working with the Smart controller MPPT if you miss the ploting by hand with these kind of Grid Ties ( Ginlong) you just through away power.

Here is a plot of the power output we are looking at

Smartmppt[1].jpg (50.96 KiB) 9270-mal betrachtet

You will never know it.

loaded 202 RPM volts 141 watts 502 ( volts are DC loaded)

405 RPM volts 175 watts 683

cogging @1ft 1.lb 08 oz to break free

I opened up the air to .060 th and reran the same test.

loaded 206 RPM volts 87 watts 205

412 RPM volts 147 watts 287

cogging was 10 OZ to break free spinned with your finger tips .

If a lift kind of blade was used I feel the big air gap is the way to go.

With the Lenz drag kind like I use and build with the tight air gap it takes

like 10 to 12 MPH to brake free my PMA using the .020 th gap works well

One thing to keep in mind is with the slanting of the magnets you do give up some power too.

Bob Mann

Hello I did up a drum with the slant that I have been selling

and reran the test.

It had 14 OZ of cogging

RPM 203 Volts 140 Watts 486

RPM 407 Volts 170 Watts 659

This is into the Ginlong if I were to play with the Volts to Watts plotting I think

I could pull more but would the wings keep it spining???
All test are run on a 1/5HP Brigeport.
Bob Mann

[labitrail]

Hi Bob,
what I am really interested in is the revolution (RPM) figure ot your rotors by a given wind speed. We are planning to use special compressors instead of an electric power generator to harvest the energy in a wider range with less loss. So, what we are looking for is a slow turning turbine with a high torque. This will allow us to use already low speeds but also to harvest high speed winds with their enormous amount of energy without the need of breaks.

[BobMann]

Hello I have one of my test unit up and it is working. This one is using the 4 inch C Full Floating on a 30 inch circle.
It is on my Mann Smart Drive on my Tree Top Wind Mill test site 80 ft up.

I have a new bolt-on hub build that will take 3 or 5 blades.
You could hear the C snaping back and forth on the stops on start up. Witch tells us it is working to catch wind.
I am building some new blades with 6 inch C and a simpler mouning system with some adjustments build in for offseting the blades from center
as in the early posts.
I am going to try 45 inch center on the next test.
Here is my Youtube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NVBirON ... 9OGjRhjaZl

I have it hooked up to the grid now the wind is coming from the back right now. The other trees are in its way.
Bob Mann

[Bernd]

Bob to me it looks like the Rotor is working against a load ?
I think so because it seems to be very windy over there and the rotor is just slightly spinning.
I am curios about the experiences you will make with the new bigger one.


Grüsse

Bernd

[labitrail]

Hi Bob,
may it be the rotor blades / Cs are trapped in a situation where the rotor is stable, that means there is a quasi equilibrium of wind forces and resistence of the blades? This may occur with really free floating Cs. I am just building a different System where the floating is limited to 1/3 of the possible radius. I hope I can finish it over Christmas.

[BobMann]

I had come to the same conclustion. I am building the front C supports so they have stops on the ends to keep the blade from closing all the way.
I will post the hinge plates next week. I am adding a 6 inch Cs to this one with stops this weekend.
My Lenz would of been flying with that wind and making 300Watts + but I have over a year in that set up design I only have 30 days with the C rotor.

Bob Mann

[BobMann]

Here is a update on the C floating wing.
I had moved the wind mill outside to make room in my shop for the day.

I still needed to install the end caps and the stator was not installed so there was no cogging to deal with.

We had some wind but a ground level it was only 1-3 MPH. As you will see it takes right off in that wind. At no time have I had any wing start at such a low wind speed.
The C did self adjust too at the ground wind speed.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=X1f1SzdPZGI&lis ... ature=plcp


I hope to test with real wind and the Mann Smart Drive installed soon for some real power output test.

Bob Mann